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need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

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  • need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

    Hi everyone, I have a 1994 XP that is really getting me frustrated.
    The problem is when I am at the lake and first put cold machine in water the engine will always start. I can ride the machine all day without any problems, runs perfactly. The problem is when I shut it down and take a break for more than 2 minutes. Nine out of ten times it will not start. I keep trying to start it until I eventually kill the battery.
    What I did discover is that if I lift the jet pump out of the water such as on a dock, it will always start, it will also always start on the trailer out of the water.

    Things I have Checked are: Rotary valve clearance is within spec.
    : electrical box all connections and grounds seem to be dry and corrosion free.
    : battery is new and good.
    : pulled flywheel stator and connections are good.
    : stator and coil ohm out to within spec.
    : spark is good
    : tried many new spark plugs
    : cleaned carbs 2 times pop off preassure is at 20 psi.
    :pouring straight gas through spark plug holes does not help.
    :engine compression is at 120 psi both sides.

    I Know the engine compression is low, could this be causing the no start problem. I do not understand why the engine runs so well when it does start.

    I am out of ideas any help to fix this no start in water problem would be appreciated.

  • #2
    Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

    If that compression reading is accurate, yes that is your problem - you have a lot of top-end damage and very low compression.
    SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
    We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
    Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

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    • #3
      Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

      what plugs to you run ?

      how good is your starter ?

      have you tryed cutting your plug wires a little ?


      what are your low speed jets set at ?

      are your plug wet or dry when trying to start ?
      PRIDE IN SERVICE<br /> <img src="http://www.sbtontheweb.com/images/forposts/4609/1.jpg" alt=" - " />

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      • #4
        Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

        I am using BR8Es plugs, I Have already dried snipping plug wires back.tried new spark plug caps. The spark plugs are always dry when I continuously crank engine. So I have poured straight gas down plug holes it does not make a difference. The starter turns engine over just as well as any other 650 xp. Low speed adjusters are set at 1.5 turns out now. I have tried adjusting in and out. Turning in makes engine miss and hesitate. Out is too rich.

        If the top end is damaged would it still run well when it does start? Because it does run well.
        Last edited by gmerz; 09-19-2004, 04:33 PM.

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        • #5
          Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

          I dont mind if I have to rebulid my top end, if that is what is causing the no start problem. My concern is if I do rebuild it, and the problem is still there. It would be a big downer.

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          • #6
            Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

            If it is damaged and you have lost some compression, yes it will run. To those that know what it's supposed to feel like, not 'well' though.
            SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
            We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
            Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

              120psi is not shot if there even it could be the guage , norm is 150psi

              you can pull the head to check the topend for damage you need no gaskets { unless you rip a Oring } you will need a torkwrench to put it back on :-)

              ive seen a lot of skis that wont start after running due to bad starters that draw to much after getting hot .
              PRIDE IN SERVICE<br /> <img src="http://www.sbtontheweb.com/images/forposts/4609/1.jpg" alt=" - " />

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              • #8
                Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                The voltage on the starter drops from 12.5 V to 10 V when the starter is engaged. I am not sure if this is normal. Could this be a possibility?
                As I said earlier the engine does start normaly in water when cold. It will also start in water if I hit the start button within a minute or so after engine is shut off. Any longer it will not start. Seems like somthing may be getting heat soaked.

                Buy the way. "Thanks for all the help Guys".
                Last edited by gmerz; 09-19-2004, 08:38 PM.

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                • #9
                  Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                  what about after your running ? 10v is pretty low
                  PRIDE IN SERVICE<br /> <img src="http://www.sbtontheweb.com/images/forposts/4609/1.jpg" alt=" - " />

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                  • #10
                    Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                    Have not checked it when running. But I Know battery is always getting charged.

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                    • #11
                      Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                      I decided to disassemble the top end of the engine this evening to take a look inside. What I found is both pistons are seiezed and lower rings are stuck. Seizure is mostly on exhaust port side. What is surprising is that the cylinders do not appear to be damaged. I will try to post pics. You guys tell me what you think. Now I have to figure out what caused this piston damage in the first place.

                      I cannot beleive the engine ran the way it did with pistons messed up like they are.
                      I want thank everybody ounce again for their advice.
                      Attached Files
                      Last edited by gmerz; 09-20-2004, 12:20 AM.

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                      • #12
                        Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                        All you do is click the attatchments button when replying.
                        SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
                        We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
                        Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                          Remove the carbs and clean them out. Especially the internal fuel filters in the carbs. Also, check the fuel selector valve in both the on and reserve positions to be sure it is not clogged up. Your pistoons got hot because it was not getting enough fuel, or there is an air leak into both sides of the motor. My guess would be lack of fuel.
                          This was not an oil related failure.
                          Bill O'Neal <br>
                          WCM
                          <a href="http://www.watercraftmagic.com"

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                          • #14
                            Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                            I was looking at the Clymer repair manual and noticed that the pistons for the 94 650x engine should have a manufactured hole on the skirt at the rotary valve side. As you can see in the pictures above, my pistons dont have this. I bought this machine second hand and I dont know the history of it. So I was wondering could the pistons I have in the engine now possibly be wrong?

                            Should the factory hole be on the skirt?
                            And if it is, why is it there?

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                            • #15
                              Re: need help 1994 XP Difficult to start in water

                              The pictures dipict an aftermarket base gasket and pistons. Not all pistons have the intake hole in the skirts, but it will not cause a problem if they are not there. The reason for them is two-fold. A very slight boost in performance and to lubricate and cool the wrist pin bearings. Looks like a WSM top end kit was used.
                              Bill O'Neal <br>
                              WCM
                              <a href="http://www.watercraftmagic.com"

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