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3 Hour Old SBT crank bearing failure

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  • 3 Hour Old SBT crank bearing failure

    A crank was send to RAD for truing and welding. Bob informed us that the crank wss not-rebuildable. My buddy decided to call SBT who took the unrebuildable crank as a core and send him a rebuild SBT GPR crank ( I told him do not do it but oh welll he did it). We finally finished the ski and took it out. Within 3 hours one of the connecting rod bearings failed, metal flew all over the took 2 pistons and 2 cylinders and a head dome out.
    SBT was contacted and they informed us that the crank was out of warranty since it was purchased over 3 months ago.............only 3 hours on it.

    For what I can see the connecting rod bearings did not look OEM. I am not sure what they are!!!!!!!

    My recommendation is if you can not get your crank rebuild by a reputable shop using stock components. Buy a new one. DO NOT ACCEPT AFTERMARKET BEARINGS, GASKETS, SEALS OR COMPONENTS AS SUBSTITUTES.

  • #2
    I'm not even going to bother to comment on the BS thread on the Riva board started by you - I will only say this...

    There are many things that can take out a crank in the manner shown in this case. The crank was sold over 90 days ago, with a CLEAR 90 DAY WARRANTY. The purchaser made his OWN decisions to wait for the crank's use, using up the warranty period of his own free-will. There is no room for debate regarding proper warranty coverage. IF it was a defective unit that lasted a claimed 3 hours, IF the unit was installed in a timely manner after purchase, it would have been covered, plain and simple.

    The bottom line here is, there is no 100% proof of the root cause of this failure as shown thusfar. It is certainly *possible* the unit had a problem, it is certainly ALSO possible there was another problem that caused the failure such as a lubrication problem, case leak, piston clearance problem, etc. No mention of any diagnostic procedures have ever been made - something we do to each engine warranty return.

    Do we use OEM purchased bearings? No. Do we use bearings purchased from the same factories as the OEMs purchase theirs, to the same standards or greater? Yes. That includes FAG, SKG, Nachi, etc. - the same as you'll find (if you could) the OEM's use. Are all those manufactures using one and only one manufacturing plant? No. Will you see multiple country of origin stamps on the same manufactures bearing? Yes. Nothing new or mysterious here. Do we have a problem using the current stock of beaings we spec for the GRP cranks? No.

    [ November 29, 2002, 07:08 PM: Message edited by: Bryan Glynn ]

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    • #3
      Well I must say ... What a Bull - Dinky thing to write. That was Yamaha Tech Support ? I can tell you there are NO problems with SBT motors or cranks and I have purchased many. The original crank was not rebuildable .. WOW there must have been some big damage there, don't suppose anything could have happened to the motor when the crank went?

      I just had to let that out , I read so much BS and usually don't say a word but this is a LOAD, Frankly with the support, service, warranty and prices I get from SBT, I can't see how anyone can say a negative word ....

      Blaine
      Thanks for All the Help !<br />Blaine

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      • #4
        This was also posted at my site! Heres a link
        My opinion is noted in my post in the link...

        [ November 29, 2002, 11:58 PM: Message edited by: skiworx ]
        Thanks, Steve....www.Ultra150.com Adminstrator /owner<br />

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        • #5
          We have an old saying here in Wyoming- whiskey gets blamed for a lot that whiskey don't do.
          A warranty is the buyers protection against a faulty product, and as Brian said, there is a "possibility" that there was a faulty bearing. SBT's warrenty on their products seems to be pretty clear to me, and I am sure, just like any other manufacturer or remanufacturer, they eat a lot of money on items destroyed by improper installation or use, as well as taking a bath on unusable core pieces. In this case, I will warranty you that had the crank been installed and destroyed during the warranty, SBT would have **** sure looked into it, and if at fault would have made it good.
          I myself have a great respect for the aftermarket seals, gaskets, bearings, pistons, and work from SBT- just as I buy parts from NAPA and Carquest for my vehicles and my company's vehicles- they are made by the same manufacturers as the factories use.
          After two cranks self-destucted in 3 hours of riding, I believe I would be looking for another problem.

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          • #6
            "I'm not even going to bother to comment on the BS thread on the Riva board started by you"

            Let me tell you something Bryan, First of all this is not a BS thread. It is a fact that the crank went out after 3 hours. I have always see you on the defensive which very well explains the type of person who you are.

            As far as the engine is concerned, Richard made the mistake of buying the crank before he got all of his other parts, and yes I understand about the 90 day warranty, but when we take out time in building an engine, on a clean en [img]/graemlins/angryfire.gif[/img] viroment, preassure test it, disassemble and clean every single carb 100%, change every seal, gasket, clean every bolt etc, etc,, break it in accordingly and a crank bearing fails and causes an incredible amount of damage we got a problem.

            If you think that I am doing to bring your company down you are wrong, I just want everyone else to be aware of my negative experience with this 90 days no good crank warranty.

            Like I told you before if you sold nothing but junk I am sure that you would not be in business, but there are always faulty components that can go bad in no time and we feel that SBT has used this 90 day warranty as an excuse not to cover us.

            We send the original crank to RAD for truing and welding and we were told that it was unrebuildable because of rust from moisture intrusion.

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            • #7
              Questions Fernando:

              What are your personal qualifications as speaking with expertise in this case? What is your professional involvement with the PWC industry or engines such that you can make informative, factual posts regarding engine failures?

              What is your personal involement with this customer? Were you the purchaser? Were you the builder? Did you inspect the parts or have them professionally inspected?

              What does another company commenting on the condition of 100% unrelated parts (customers previous crank) have to do with this crank?

              How *exactly* have you determined the crank bearing to be the root cause of this failure? Making ASSUMPTIONS is NOT a determination, before you even go down that road. ASSUMING that because you feel you took adaquate care in assembly, or ASSUME that nothing else could have failed, is not a determination. What EXACTLY pointed you to the crank bearing as the root cause?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Fercho:
                A crank was send to RAD for truing and welding. Bob informed us that the crank wss not-rebuildable. My buddy decided to call SBT who took the unrebuildable crank as a core and send him a rebuild SBT GPR crank
                Why would you send someone a known unrebuildable piece for a core? Isn't it customary to send a rebuildable part as a core? What was the sender trying to achieve when he/she sent a known bad core and hope to get core credit?
                Red 03 GTX SC and Yellow 03 GTX SC

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                • #9
                  Actually it is not rocket science to put an engine together, and I do not think that your customer have to pre-qualify to buy your parts or do they????.

                  Richard was the purchaser and I assembled the engine.

                  The other crank had actually several rusted bearings and it was going to be cheaper to buy a newone than to rebuild it.

                  The day before the engine locked up I check compression after riding and noticed that the engine was cranking slow. I tough that it was the battery. We came to realize that it was the bearings already letting go which were dragging and putting a load on the engine.

                  Bryan we only want for this crank to be taken care of. We are not asking for any type of damages.

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                  • #10
                    No one said it takes a rocket scientist, but it certainly does take a highly qualified and expereinced professional to assemble an engine well and make it last. Something that a GREAT many backyard mechanics think they are qulified to do.

                    No you certainly do not need to hold any accreditations to purchase our products, but I would certainly hope that our customers either A) have the necessary skill needed to assemble the engine, or B) pay someone who is. Otherwise you end up with broken parts, and don't necessarily know why.

                    How thoughtful of you that you aren't looking for incidental charges - it's quite clear in the warranty that they are not covered in the first place.

                    If it were up to me, this crank would certainly not be covered under warranty, as the period had clearly expired. It's not up to me in this case however, and quite frankly, it doesn't matter whatsoever what YOU want as you have zero to do with this purchase (or any other SBT purchase). It's between the Owner and the customer at this point.

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                    • #11
                      How thoughtful of you that you aren't looking for incidental charges - it's quite clear in the warranty that they are not covered in the first place.

                      I am not sure how much you know about the law. Companies can set their own warranty and policies in florida, but individual state legislature overrides any of such. Remember tranfer of ownership takes place once the item is in the hands of the consumer.

                      That is why there are plenty of consumer protection laws out there.

                      99% of my clients are attorney's and I am in a very delicate field where I have to watch every step that I make to cover my rear. I can make my own rules but when it comes to legality some of them may not apply.

                      The same applies to me as a landlord. I have to be careful how I evict people regardless of what my contract states because there are laws out there that will override any contract that I may have.

                      FYI

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                      • #12
                        No one said it takes a rocket scientist, but it certainly does take a highly qualified and expereinced professional to assemble an engine well and make it last. Something that a GREAT many backyard mechanics think they are qulified to do.

                        I have been working on engines since I was 20. Not professionaly but good enough to now the necessary steps. And to be honest with you some of the techs at the dealerships are un-qualified. I have more than one Yamaha certified techs that have called me for help with GPR and XLL problems. I had one that gave up when he found out that the carbs needed to come out

                        You will be surprised in how many people take on a job and have no idea where to strart.

                        [ December 01, 2002, 01:25 AM: Message edited by: Fercho ]

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                        • #13
                          SBT Warranty

                          I suggest you read this before you try to make more uneducated statements.

                          People like you remind me of the guy returning the rental car in Jack*** - totals the car, signed the no insurance clause then says' Oh that's just paperwork, you guys can cover it for me' when returning it.

                          We do NOT cover incidental damages. We have a CLEAR 90 day warranty on cranks. This reply is just for public information's sake - I'm one discussing this with you as you are not the customer in this case, nor a professional.

                          [ December 01, 2002, 01:29 AM: Message edited by: Bryan Glynn ]

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                          • #14
                            I can see that you have the IQ of a peanut.

                            I wonder how many customers signed the dotted line

                            Reply back to the Riva board I am out of here

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                            • #15
                              That's exactly the responce I expected from you.

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