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Working on two 1200s

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  • #16
    Re: Working on two 1200s

    Ongoing saga of the two 1200s.

    99 Is running good but gauges are screwy.
    The oil level gauge does not work right and the speedometer reads anywhere
    up to 68MPH,when I know thats not even close.
    Fuel gage seems to work but they are never really accurate.
    I have gone thru 4 tanks of gas since I bought the 99.

    1st tank Blown motor.
    2nd tank lost a pivot bolt and broke off steering nozzle.
    3rd tank Screw that holds grip to handle bars came loose and almost fell out.
    4th tank Lost trim,the wheel that operates the mechanism broke.
    I replaced with the steering nozzle with the one from my 97 and I found that
    one of the pivot bolts that operate the trim had the wrong bushing in it.
    I am going to put my Bullett auto drop nozzle on the 97 and I can take wheel from 97 and use it on the 99.

    The 97 is still not up and running.
    It will run good on the trailer but not in the water I made a homemade timing tape and set the timing at 30 deg BTDC.
    I am going to try different jets.
    It dies when I give it any gas at all.
    Still have a cooling problem and center chamber is not geting water flow.
    I have not been able to find any blockage and thinking about adding another
    1/2" cooling line from the pump.
    I'm not sure how to run this thru the hull or exactly where to tap into the pump.

    Both have aftermarket heads on them and I have only run the 99 at speed but engine temprature is a lot hotter than it was with the stock head.
    Have read at severall diferent websites that the stock head has the best
    cooling characteristics.
    Surely by now someone should have designed a head that is better than stock with equal or better cooling.
    99 has Pro design Cool head 44cc domes ?psi.
    97 has Pro tec C3 girdled head 42cc domer 150psi.
    SCOTT...

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    • #17
      Re: Working on two 1200s

      what are your current carb settings (n/s, high/low jet size, popoff)?

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      • #18
        Re: Working on two 1200s

        2.3 Needles and seats.
        115gm springs.
        130 main jets.
        115 pilot jet Front.
        112.5 pilot jet Center and Rear.

        Highs out 1 1/2 turns.
        Lows out 1 1/4 turns.
        22Psi Pop off.

        I dont have a Pop-off gage so Pop off is from the book.
        I think carbs came with 120 pilot and 150 main I will take a look and might try switching jets.
        SCOTT...

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        • #19
          Re: Working on two 1200s

          99 running good but I have not adjusted the ride plate yet.

          97 has new jets in it and going to try it today.
          I have installed a second 1/2" cooling line and the Bullett auto drop nozzle.
          I am still missing the pivot bolt collars for the steering but I can switch them from stock unit on the 99 to test the 97.
          I have a pump coming and I will be switching some pump components including these collars when it gets here.
          I'm off to the lake to try my new carb set up.
          SCOTT...

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          • #20
            Re: Working on two 1200s

            Originally posted by Technical Support

            The rear seals should be positioned so the legs are on the the outside. If they are not, yes switch them so they don't fall out.
            Falling out? Have you seen this?

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            • #21
              Re: Working on two 1200s

              Hooked up with Pistonwash who was giving me advice.
              We went to the river and I took out the 99 GP1200 and It ran like crap.
              Pulled plugs and #2 was wet and fouled.
              I checked my grounds and the coil put in fresh plugs and all plugs were sparking.
              I have gas and I have spark but still nothing from cylinder #2.
              I then used my thumb to test for compresion and #2 had nothing.
              Time to pull the motor again.

              When we looked at the 97 GP1200 we tried different retard settings in the control module with no success.
              Decided to retard ignition by rotating the triger plate.
              I was going to do this today but I found that one to many backfires and my rear seals are coming out again.
              Time to pull this motor again also.
              I am going to have to do some sort of modification to stop rear seals from coming out.
              I'm thinking I can put a plate on the back of the cases to hold the seals in place.
              SCOTT...

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Working on two 1200s

                Yes you can fabricate a holding plate, ala Tigershark triple.
                SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
                We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
                Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

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                • #23
                  Re: Working on two 1200s

                  Have you any idea if the tigershark plate could be modified to work on the Yamaha.

                  I looked at the parts diagram but it only shows the item but does not give any dimentions for machining.
                  I have no idea if shafts are close in size.
                  It also looks like plate is flat and I would need a spacer to clear the boss on the back of the 1200 motor.

                  My other options might include making a plate out of plastic.
                  SCOTT...

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                  • #24
                    Re: Working on two 1200s

                    It would be easier to just machine a plate from sheet stock. All you need are two small strips on either side and to drill/tap holes.
                    SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
                    We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
                    Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Working on two 1200s

                      It sounds prety easy I sure wish I had thought about doing this before as this is the third time Ive had to pull the motor because of this rear seal problem.
                      It seems that this might be an improvement over stock that could be implimented by SBT cheaply and would reduce the # of returned (waranted) motors as this should stop seals from blowing out.
                      The second time I had this problem the motor was out of waranty as it is this time.
                      Pulling the motor this time will be a mutch bigger job than before with the modifications I have done.
                      That triple pipe is a real bear but removing should be half the job of putting it back in.
                      Stock motor takes about five hours to remove lets see how long this one takes.
                      It is starting to look like I may not get the 97triple pipe up to speed while we still have some sumer weather but I wont give up.

                      The 99will be a lot easier to get running again but when I last had it apart (top end job) the cylinder ports and the sleeve ports were severely mismatched I think someone has tried to change the exhaust port timing and
                      that might be breaking rings.
                      I have not pulled motor or removed the head yet.
                      I need to know proper location of ports to determine if I can get cylinders sleeved properly or if I need to get some other cylinders.
                      I was sold this 99 with 75 hours and 1st tank blew #1 piston head etc,then I had it rebored.
                      I have put around 10 hours on it since I fixed blown #1 piston.
                      Previose owner denied any knowledge of it having been resleeved.
                      He gave me the phone # for the person he bought it from (At least thats what he said) and he told me that he sold it to Rob with 40 hours and that he had no knowledge of it being resleeved.
                      I made these calls to find out why it was sleeved the way it and according to these part two owners it was done before either one of them owned the boat.
                      If this is the case then it happened in the 1st 40 hours.
                      I will try and send some pics when I get it apart.
                      I should have researched this more thoroughly before I put it back together all I was thinking is that I wanted ro get out on the water before the season was over.
                      The 99 was suposed to be a reliable ride while I modified the 97 that's why I bought it in the 1st place.
                      Learning how these things tick has been very fulfilling but even more frustrating as I have probably spent $10,000 (dont want to add up total cost)
                      and only got to ride10 hours.
                      It looks like sumer is almost over here in Illinois and I have a lot more workto do.
                      SCOTT...

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Working on two 1200s

                        It's not worth the time and expense to us. The returns due to the rear seals coming out on thier own is a fraction of 1 percent of the returns. 99% of the time they are pushed out from water or a backfire.
                        SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
                        We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
                        Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Working on two 1200s

                          This is a known weakness with the 1200 so why not improve over stock.
                          Its one of your selling points that you improve weaknesses with engines.
                          That was my only point I know they come out for a reason.
                          SCOTT...

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Working on two 1200s

                            Because it's not nearly a big enough issue to spend money on. We would have to jig up and drill 4 holes, tap them, have plates made and use new bolts on every single 1100/1200 that comes through here. To fix MAYBE 2-3 a year we see having that problem specifically. Nope, just not an issue.

                            I forgot the biggest cause for the seals popping out when someone built it themselves - improper installation.
                            SBT Tech Support is here to help with your problems.
                            We try to answer each question quickly and accurately.
                            Please do not use Private Messaging for Tech Support, use the forums.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Working on two 1200s

                              I did have my last set of seals in wrong,I had asked SBT about instalation it was either on the phone or on the website and I was told that yes I had them in the correct location.
                              I gave a description of my instalation and even gave the #s on each seal and
                              its position.
                              Before I instaled the motor I saw that the seals in my other 1200 were in the opposite locations.
                              I then asked if my seals were installed wrong.
                              I was told they were and reinstaled them before puting motor in.
                              I know they came out from a backfire not from being instaled incorectly.
                              I have been strugling to get triple piped 1200 tuned and have had some backfiring.
                              If I had thought of an easy fix for thos while it was out I would have done it.
                              It still seems like the cost to do this is verry minimal and well worth the cost.
                              Even if you had it as a optionall modification at a low costI would bet a lot of people with any knowledge of this isue would be more than happy to purchase it.
                              I am a machinist and know how easy this is to do.
                              If you made a jig it would cost you next to nothing.
                              If you did it on a cnc machine all you would have to do is write a couple of programs.
                              Your bigest cost would be materials and this can be passed on to the consumer.
                              You dont think it would be worth it as you dont get a lot of returns but I agree to disagree.
                              I will let this go as we are of different opinions.
                              I think that when I make a keeper plate the seals will stay put.
                              I have not heard of the front seal blowing out probably because its a smaller size and under less preasure.
                              I certainly apreciate this site and all the knowledgeable and helpfull people and SBTadvisors who will help you whenever thay can.
                              At this time I am unemployed and I dont have access to a machinibg center
                              but I will have no problem making up a plate.
                              SCOTT...

                              Thanks again for your help.
                              SCOTT...

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Working on two 1200s

                                Mike will get you up and running. He is THE GP guru.
                                J-me
                                05 Bayliner 175
                                98 GP 1200 Yamaha factory support hull, Lamey engine, Skat pump

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