800 sxr R & D timing advance

[poozine]

If I were to install the R & D timing advance plate on my 2003 sxr, will the carb need to be re-tuned? I don't think that it will, but I just want to make sure before I order the kit. Also does the O-ring that came stock with the boat, or the gasket style seal that comes with the r & d timing advance provide a better seal? I have had problems with water getting into my genrator cover and now the fly wheel and stator have a little bit of rust on them. The dealer replaced the starter bendix under warranty becuase of the bendix rusting and freezing up. The reason why I want to add the kit is that I have pulled off the generator cover to check out what it looks like in there and to see if I coudn't clean it up a little. When I pulled it off I found that the stupid dealer used silcone to provide a seal around the O-ring instead of grease for the generator cover. I can order a new O-ring from my local dealer for close to $20.00 with tax or order an advance timing kit that comes with a gasket style seal instead of an O-ring for $45.00. Just need help in deciding what which seal I want to put back on there. THanks again.
Chris
805 Wave pavers

[Bill O'Neal2]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

You do not have a choice. The R&D gasket is mandatory for proper spacing of the ignition pickup. Lightly cover the gasket with grease, you do not need the oring.

No carb jetting changes, other than possibly some low speed adjustment with the adjuster needle, is necessary, unless you have an aftermarket flame arresstor installed.

[poozine]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

I have taken out the air sliencers that are on both sides of my flame arrestor. But I was actually thinking about purchasing some after market ones soon anyways. Since my 800 is a dual carb, if I do need to adjust the low speed neddle, should I move both needles the exact same amount? I can get a single carb jet ski running, but I have never been good at tunning dual carbs, it is so hard.

[poozine]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

I just ordered the timing advance kit from watercraftwerks.com. What flame arrestors would anyone recommend? The fly arrestors look pretty cool, but they talk about the R&D power pleneum on the groupk site.

[john zigler]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

i have a new set of ocean pro vortex filters. 60.00/complete. these will fit your SXr. these are a "flame arrestor" with out cotton insert, that will choke your eng. when wet. they also have a "vortex" cone in the center of the top to help direct air into the carb creating more hp. thanks and give me an email if interested. zig

email. radracingpwc@aol.com

[Bill O'Neal1]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

If you go with aftermarket arresstors, you had better get the jetting instructions with the arresstors. Typically, just adjusting the needles is not enough with aftermarket arresstors and you will be setting yourself up for a disaster. Remember you will be advancing your overall timing curve by a whopping 6 degrees. That means instead of the timing being at 12 degrees at full throttle, it will be at 18 degrees, and that, my friend, is a BUNCH of timing.

[poozine]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

Bill

1) Did you read my message about already taking out the silencers on my stock flame arrestor?
2) Do you think that taking out those silencers will be sufficient for installing a timing advance kit?
3) What do you mean by jetting instructions for the flame arrestors? I thought you said re-jetting wasn't neccessary? Also you said adjustment sometimes isn't enough.
4) I see that you are in California. Is there any chance I talk to you on the phone or get your email address? This talking online just takes too long. Just PM me. Thanks

My buddy bought a used SXR and it came with a timing advance kit already, atleast that is what the last guy told him, and he had stock flame arrestors.

[Bill O'Neal2]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

You can call me at 626 914 9509 or email me at cdofixr@msn.com

FYI, if you click on my name here, you get my email address..

1. Yes

2. What do you mean by be sufficent by removing silencers? What has a silencer got to do with a timing advance kit ? You lost me there.

3.You misunderstood me. I said *IF* you have stock oem arresstors, you may not need to rejet. Now you are saying you are putting aftermarket flame arresstors on your motor. If you do, you will need to rejet your carbs.

Anyone reputable that sells aftermarket arresstors will give you the proper instructions for rejetting. If they don't, or won't, then they are nothing but a salesperson who could care less if you sieze your motor.

[poozine]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

Hey Bill,

I think I understand you now. I had thought previously that you said that I would either a) need to adjust my low speed jet to compensate for the timing advance while still using my stock flame arrestors, or b) if I had already installed an aftermarket flame arrestor, that I would not need to adjust my jets or re-jet becuase the new flame arrestors would have already compenstated for the timing advance.

But I think I got he jist now.

I presently have the stock flame arrestor with the side silencer tubes taken out. I have never adjusted my carbs when did that. When I install the timing advance kit, do you think that there will be any possibility that I will not need to adjust the low speed? If I do need to adjust the low speed, I need to richen the fuel, correct? Thanks again Bill, I might still call you just so I know that I have gotten every think correct that you have tole me.

As for the aftermarket arrestors, I was just thinking about purchasing some, but it was not a rock solid plan. After what I have heard from you I don't think that I will be pursching any at all.

THank Chris

[dsolie]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

Chris,

By all means install the F/A's but re-jet accordingly. Call Bill up and he will tell you exactly what you need to do. He even has the jets that you need to make it happen. Aftermarket Flame Arrstors REALLY wake up the ski and make it a whole new ride.

Bill is a god here, and his knowledge and assistance are invaluable.. Tap into it, you will be glad you did.

[Bill O'Neal2]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

Chris,
According to R&D Racing, when you install the timing advance on a stock ski, you may or may not have to make adjustments to the low speed adjuster to get it to accellerate correctly and idle properly. This is a typical thing that needs to be done when installing aftermarket engine parts. Do what is necessary.

[john zigler]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

Anyone reputable that sells aftermarket arresstors will give you the proper instructions for rejetting. If they don't, or won't, then they are nothing but a salesperson who could care less if you sieze your motor.


bill, just what are you trying to say here? i have NEVER seen any jetting instructions come with air filters. that is just crazy. these fit many different machines. ( seadoo 720, kaw 750, 800, ect. basically anything with a MIK SBN "I" series carb). there are many different variables with each machine. (engine mods, pipe, timing, head ect). even your altitude will make a difference. to say that i don't care about you, and your machine is downright WRONG!!!! i do care. and i can get you in the ball park. you " may " need to jet up a few sizes, and will probably need to lower the pop off presure. but without the boat here to do my self, it is up to him to take plug readings and fine tune the jetting.

[Bill O'Neal1]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

John,

So I guess you have told him what he needs to know, as you stated you told him " you may need to jet up a few sizes" and "probably need to lower the pop off pressure".

So, why does my statement pretain to you?

We are also discussing this same thing over in the Sea Doo forum, where a guy got a set of filters and a huge rejetting change for his 951 and he wonders why he lost about 400 rpm or so.
It is just me, but I think if you sell products that can drastically effect the reliability or performance of a given watercraft, you should know the set up and have tested it....... so you can, with confidence, be somewhat sure that you are not selling something that will do some real damage.
I bet I've repaired over 100 engines, maybe more, that owners have installed air filters onto and were never told that they needed to rejet their carbs. Some of that responsibility must be placed on the owner for not doing his homework, but some ( most ) needs to go to the salesperson who sold it and didn't tell them about the dangers of not rejetting, or gave false information.

[poozine]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

Bill,

I just got my timing advance in the mail, and the kit says that the stock oring should be used in conjunction with the new gasket/spacer. But the instructions says exactly

after installing the advance plate

"Now reinstall the front cover assemly. Be sure the O-ring is properly seated. Although the spacer is self-sealing, the stock O-ring must still be used. Tighten all hardware and you're finished. Have fun and please ride safely."

What do you think I should do, install it with some grease and forget about the stock o-ring? My whole plan in the first place was to purchase the advance kit instead of stock o-ring and now I gotta have both? Oh brother.

Let me know what you think. The kit is called a TK Timing Advance Plate. I asume from TK.

Thanks

[Bill O'Neal2]

Re: 800 sxr R & D timing advance

I would definately do exactly what the instructions tell you to do. I have no idea how a TK ( Tom Kerker) advance plate is spaced in relation to the pickup and coverplate. It seems that they made a point of using the oring in there instructions.

You can buy oring material in rope form from most bearing supply stores for about 50 cents a foot or so. For under $3.00, you should be able to afford an oring. Just superglue the ends to gether at the top of the mag housing.

You can buy it online from Mc Master-Carr Industrial Suppy. Just measure the diameter and length of the oring so you know what to order.