02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

[XPBri]

OK, some of you know the history of my boat, for those that don't:
02 XP-
Rossier Pipe - 200 jet in the stinger (water jetting and carb jetting recc. by Rossier)
Carbs F/A's 160 Mains, 105 Pilots 2.3 N&S, No accel pumps
Micro Touch rev limiter/ ignition controller running the 99 XPL curve +2 to intial timing, Rev limit set at 7750, timing retarded 1 degree over 5000 RPM, water injection on at 2500 off at 5900
Running the 04 Plastic pump with a stock 923 prop
ADA head with 50cc domes .065 squish with a 3 hole base gasket- lastest compression read was 160+

About two weeks ago I thought I was getting closer to having this ski dialed in. Well today was a bit cooler out and a lost a decent amount of RPM, I was topping out at 7250, now I'm lucky to hit 6850. The pump and prop are undamaged. Is it possible that the cooler air caused that drastic drop in RPM? (Ski may be too rich on top?)
Any input is welcome, especially if anyone is running a Rossie pipe- I think there are 3 people in the country running them, haha.
Chris (1FastSki) I'd like to try and bring the ski by you, to have you tune it- if I fail at this again:D Let me know if there is a good time to bring the ski by you.
Thanks,
Bri

[drb]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

I doubt if you lost 400 rpm due to the weather. Sounds like a rave problem or an internal crack in the pipe. Are you sure the raves are opening?

Have you pressure checked the pipe? I have two Rossier 951 pipes and they are definately prone to cracking.

I am running the same basic set-up on a 99 GSX-L with a stock MPEM - no advanced timing - and I get 7050 to 7100 RPM with the stock 920 prop. What's a 923 prop? The stock prop for a 02 Xp is a 271 000 920.

Dan

[XPBri]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Thanks Dan,


This is a pick of the prop thats in the boat:


Thats where I got the "923" from, so I'm probably using the wrong # to classify it.
I can't get this setup right- today I spent hours trying to get this thing to run better- it's getting worse Tried playing with the carb settings with no positive results. The ski performed the worst it ever has, I barely could pull away from my buddies XP800 that I just rebuilt the carbs on. The boat was topping out at 5800 RPM on the hot tach, and 55 MPH on the dream-o-meter.
Here's a couple pics of the pistons, and head after the tuning today
The plugs that aren't in the head have about 1.5 hrs on them
The ones in the head have a couple high speed passes on them.
If you need any particular info- let me know, I'm really getting tired of playing with the carbs LOL
Thanks,
Bri

[XPBri]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Dan- How many PSI should the pipe hold, and for how long?
Thanks,
Bri

[drb]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Sounds like the raves might not be opening. If you have your water to the headpipe set to shut off at 5900 RPM and you are only getting 5800 RPM the water is not shutting off. You can take the cap and spring off the raves and run it without them to see if its a rave problem. Bottom end will suck but if top end comes back you have a rave problem.

I pressure check the pipe at 15 psig. It should hold pressure forever unless your fittings are leaking. I usually block it in at 15 psig and if it hasn't dropped more than 1 or 2 psig in 5 minutes I call it good. Whenever I have had a crack in the pipe the pressure drops like a rock - you can hear the air going into the pipe.

See pics for testing method.

Dan

[XPBri]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

ROFL- I owe you at least a tractor trailer of beer:emoticonc
Although I wish it were the Rave valves- that POS of a pipe fails the pressure test miserably. Once you had the pipe repaired, did you use it, or sell it? Also, since Rossier no longer deals with watercraft, did you have a welder TIG the pipe- or is there a specialty watercraft pipe repair outfit?
Dan, I owe you big. It sux the pipe is cracked, but now I know it's not my tuning that completely sux;)
Thanks Again,
Bri

[drb]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Glad you found the problem, but it sucks that your pipe is cracked. Depending on where it is cracked it might not be repairable. The most common place they crack is around where the fitting on the bottom of the headpipe goes through the inner wall. To fix this you need to cut a hole in the outer wall to get access & then weld a patch back to the outer wall to close it up - see picture.

The pipe I am currently running has had one minor external repair. The pipe in the pictures above has been repaired several times and I now keep it as a back up.

I found a welder locally who knows how to weld aluminum - does a good job. Even though I have spent thousands with Rossier they won't give me the time of day. I once bought a pipe from them that cracked in the first two hours and they wouldn't cover it. Basically they say if the pipe cracked there must be something wrong with the ski.

Find out where the crack is and get a local welder. You might also be able to get Coffman to fix it since they made the pipes for Rossier. Or try Jim Budnick in Michigan (on Snky Pete & Team Tweek forum), I think he can weld these.

Good luck

Dan

[SHOOTER]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Brian Brian Brian, hahahahaha, at least now we know where you were having problems. Your setup is still rich.
Lean her out boyyyyyy.
Dan, Bri has a guy locally that can do it. I just hope its repairable, he's been fighting this problem for a while now. Glad you gave him the tip on it because I would not have thought the pipe would have cracked being that it only has minutes, maybe an hour or two on it.
Patch it up, sell it, get a coffmans, :)
SHOOTER

[XPBri]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Well here it is- Dan I'm almost positive this is where your pipes were leaking from too. This should be a fairly easy fix- whatever company manufactured these pipes needs to get a more qualified welder. The point that the pipe "cracked" wasn't actually a crack it was a very poor penetrating weld that allowed the water injection bung to vibrate loose and tear the pipe. SHOOTER- wanna buy a Rossi pipe?> HAHA
Thanks,
Bri

[SHOOTER]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

man o man. Just fix it up and use it again. Just make sure who ever welds it does a better job.
SHOOTER

[fedorov5549]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

What is the water routing for this pipe? I also have microtouch water injection.

fedorov5549 at hotmail.com

[SHOOTER]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

fed, you might want to pm him.
SHOOTER

[XPBri]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Just got back in from upstate NY, the easiest way to route the water on a Rossier Pipe- buy a stand up ;) Seriously though, here are the complete Rossier pipe instructions (Sorry for the photos, the scanner is broken) click the images labeled Rossi page1-4, then click the image that appears the resolution is pretty high so you should be able to read them easily. These instructions were given to me by someone else (That person saved my arse) thats where all the side notes come from. If you have a fax machine, PM me the number and I'll fax them over.
http://viscid.net/4gallery/view_albu...Doo-XPL&page=2
The link to follow is above
Hope it helps,
Bri
BTW- SHOOTER wanna buy an extremely reliable/fast XPL? LOL

[drb]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

Bri/fedorov5549- those instructions were written before Rossier started recommending a Microtouch Water Controller & Solenoid to inject water at the head pipe. I have ran the Rossier Pipe both with and without the water injection in several different set-ups and it always ran better with the water injection. I will attach some pic's to help clarify thje Rossier instructions.

Dan

[drb]

Re: 02 XP with mods- think it needs help LOL

I have gotten the best performance when I set the MT water controller to come on at between 2000 & 2300 RPM & shut off at approx. 6650 RPM. You can download instructions for any of the Micro Touch Water controllers on their web site.


Dan