97 XP Won't Turn Over

[fasteride]

My 97 xp seadoo will not turn over. I remove the plugs and it cranks fine. Now I have removed the front cover and the flywheel is fine. I bought a starter from SBT and it still does the same. I put in a new battery and still the same. I bypassed the relay/silnoid and still the same. It will not turn over unless I removed the plugs. Its not a battery wire problem, they are fine. I can not figure out why I can turn it with my hand without the plugs in, and I can install the plugs and turn it with my hand, with the compression and can still get it to turn. Puzzling. Could my new SBT starter be bad. I think my other starter was fine and its something else. Help me here. Thanks Fast...

[Technical Support]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Make sure there is no paint on the ground surfaces on the starter.

[H2ODawgs]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Fasteride, I have the same problem on a 96 GTX right now. I've replaced the solenoid, starter from sbt, both power wires to starter, checked fuses, etc. etc. and EXACT same symptoms as you. Motor appears fine, turns with plugs out and shows no oil or water from sparkplug holes. I am totally biffed. Seems like it has to be a major power drain somewhere but I cannot isolate it. If you find a solution, please let me know. FWIW, my 97 GSX is now doing the same thing also (I think). I'll have to double check the battery on it to be sure but it is a high amp sealed battery I bought a week ago and now it is having the same symptoms.

[fasteride]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

I will be back on it by Friday. Tech Support, I think the bolts that hold the starter in place provide sufficent ground. You must be thinking the paint job on the new starter might be not allowing the starter to grab enough motor medal? I have applied a straight set of jumper cables just to power this new starter and it will not crank over the engine unless the plugs are out of the engine. I can turn the engine over with the plugs in or out. Of course it turns over easy with plugs out. But it does turn over. I am wondering if the starter came to me bad from SBT. Dawg as soon as its figured out, and it will be figured out, I will let you know. to be continued........ fast

[H2ODawgs]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Fast, I got the GTX started. Still not sure what the problem is but here is what I did. Removed the new starter to check teeth, alignment, etc. No problems noticed. Re-installed, same symptoms. At this point I decided to straight wire, and I do mean straight. Unplugged every connection on the doo. Rear box, front box, gauges, ...everything. Then with 2 auto battery cables (new) I directly connected the starter and double grounded the motor. One ground at the starter and another cable to some open threads on the back of the motor around the pto. The (+) cable actually had a keyed switch (the type of plastic aftermarket key to prevent theft) that I had placed in the middle of the wire. I don't like sparks around the battery or any unnecessary "welding". On the first attempt, bendix clapped and motor turned once and stopped. I left the switch on long enough for the wire to get a little warm so I would know for sure current was still flowing. Gave it a couple of minutes to cool and turned the key again. This time it was obviously more torque from the starter and the doo fired up and fogged the whole neighborhood. This one always smokes a good bit since I have it set a little on the rich side but it did have a good oil burn for a couple of minutes. I was hooked to a flush so I let it run for a good 6 or 7 minutes to make sure I burned off residual oil, purged the carbs, and circulated the cooling system real good. After shut down I went back and hooked up all wiring and connected it to the same battery I had been trying to start it with. This time the lanyard beeped a couple of times (something it hasn't been doing for last 2 years) and the motor fired right up. If I weren't so darned tired of fighting this thing I'd put the OEM starter back on just to prove it wasn't the starter all along but since it is running and the other doo is dead, I've got bigger fish to clean right now. I will leave well enough alone for now. Not sure what the problem was but I still suspect some hokey-pokey in all the wiring. Hope you get to the bottom of yours soon. Keep me posted.

[H2ODawgs]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Also, I agree with you on the grounding issue. Too many people have suggested removing the paint, etc, etc. Hey, if you are using a clean bolt and your terminal is clean (next to bolt head), then it should ground with the threads of the bolt alone assuming you tighten it well. I've had many people tell me to make sure that all the paint was scraped from the grounding mount and that really makes no sense to me. Especially if you ohm it out and and get a good reading on the ground.
Good luck this weekend!

[fasteride]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

I have some things I am going to do. I will let you know Dawg. fast

[Technical Support]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

If the bolts that hold the starter to the block are sitting on top of a painted surface you will have grounding issues, the paint will act as an insulator.

[fasteride]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

tech-supp. i am going to check it Friday. I know what your referring to. to be continued........

[fasteride]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Got it fixed. Dawg, this for you especially! I removed the SBT starter to find that it was a 9 tooth starter and my original was an 8 tooth. So that was a problem. Since like you Dawg, I felt the original starter was ok, then it must be a ground issue like tech said. I took the original starter and sanded all the bolt areas. I then cleaned the ground wire as well as the hot wire. I reinstalled the starter. Now I can tell you that I am not a fan of the hex bolts that holds the starter. You have to make sure that the areas are clean. Then you put the nut on to secure it tighter. After I got the starter back on, I reconnected the two connectors and then the battery cables and like you I got the beeps back. I hit the button and it cranked great and fired right up. I seemed to have its old cranking power back. Where the starter is and how the bolts are does not make this a user friendly repair. Important to know that if you experience a loose ground or the starter comes loose with usage and vibration over a period of time, (which may or may not happen); you will have battery charging issues. You will think you have a bad battery. So remember that ground is a main issue by that dam starter. I will buy another ground wire and connect it with the other ground wire on the starter from the battery, and then connect it to the engine somewhere to ensure a good engine ground. Ground seems to be a bitch on these if you don't keep a eye on it. But for now all is well and don't forget to unhook your lanyard when you are done, because power is on to the ski if you don't and it can drain the battery. Happy Skiing........ fast......

[Technical Support]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Proper grounding is a big issue when it comes to watercraft electrical systems. I think Sea-doos have more starter grounding issues than most other brands.

[H2ODawgs]

Re: 97 XP Won't Turn Over

Hey Fast, thanks! I have both of mine working now and it turned out that the new sbt starters I bought were unnecessary. Guess it's good that I have them for future use but both of my old starters were perfectly fine. I think the secondary grounding wire is a very good idea and I have left both grounding wires on mine just for good measure. Turned out my problem was, believe it or not, 2 bad brand new maint-free batteries and a broken wire on a jumper cable. I bought 2 new Power Source maint-free (high dollar) batteries before all of this began. Just after I had replaced starters, solenoids, wires etc. I tried to charge one of the batteries a bit. It "swole up" like a toad in less than 15 minutes. Turns out a cell in the center of the battery overheated and damned near blew up. Thankfully I was still in the shop and noticed the smell just in time to shut it down and avoid catastrophe. Since both were brand new I took them both back and the battery supplier attempted a charge on the other (good) battery and got the same results in less than 5 minutes of charging. Looks to be a defect in that batch of batteries. Apparently the car battery would not start it due to partially broken jumper cable. It was about half way down the cable and not visible until I used it to gound an arc welder (to test the cable) and sparks burned thru the insulation. I guess the lesson here for everyone is to eliminate all possibilites of weak or dead batteries (even if brand new) and to be absolutely sure that the starter and even the motor is well grounded. Looks like it would have saved both of us some time and money but we thought we had already covered those issues.
Thanks for your input and glad you are back in the water and wiser for the experience!